A Perfectly Imperfect Union: Reflecting on America 250 with Sarah Gobel
The Whole Again Podcast: Mindfulness and Resilience through Kinstugi Wisdom airs every Monday, Wednesday and Friday with Pause Breathe Reflect Microdose Meditations, Growth Mindset and Mindfulness Tips, to help us transform our scars into healing and resilience.
And between May and October, I'm sharing a new series I'm calling: A Perfectly Imperfect Union. It's about connecting with every day folks as they reflect on America at 250. Conversations will air every Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday.
-------
What does America look like when you're willing to question the whole system?
This is a question that Sarah Gobel has reflected on. A marketing professional, mom, and founder of the Honest Diagnosis Project
America, she says, was sold to us as the land of opportunity. But right now? It feels more like a country deep in its growing pains, stuck in a two-party system that serves the people at the top while leaving everyone else to sort through the wreckage.
In 2024, after her infant son was misdiagnosed at a children's hospital, the state removed both of her children for six months. What she found when she went public- thousands of families going through the exact same thing- turned a mother's worst nightmare into a nonprofit and a mission. You can read more about her family's ordeal here.
You can also connect with Sarah on LinkedIn
Sarah has a question for you and the next guest in our series, Maggie:
What do you think is actually working in the American justice system?
Share your thoughts in the comments and share this episode with someone you love.
You can now download my Pause Breathe Reflect App with Microdose EQ for FREE in Apple’s App Store or Google Play. Discover how spend less time on your phone and more time on things that bring you joy. Also, find the support you need to navigate today’s uncertainty with more calm and grace.
Receive a FREE copy of my book: “My Last Bad Day Shift.”
Join me on Substack https://substack.com/@milkshakeswithmichael for more ways to stay resilient and navigate today’s uncertainty with more grace.
We can also connect on LinkedIn.
Subscribe to be sure you don’t miss any of the micro-meditations, wellness tips, and guidance that I publish every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday at 7:11 am.
With Whole Again: Mindfulness and Resilience through Kintsugi Wisdom, listeners explore mindfulness and resilience through personal stories of trauma, scars, and injury while learning to overcome, imposter syndrome, self-doubt, and perfectionism with self-compassion, self-love, and self-worth. Through insightful discussions on building resilience, fitness, and stress management, as well as mindfulness practices and digital wellness, the show offers practical tools such as breathwork, micro-dose meditation, grounding techniques, visualization, and daily affirmations for anxiety relief and stress reduction. Inspired by the art of kintsugi, the podcast embodies healing as a transformative process, encouraging a shift in perspective from worry and overwhelm to gratitude and personal growth. By exploring the mind-body connection, micro-dosing strategies for emotional well-being, and
<p> Hey there, it's Michael. Welcome to Whole Again, the show that's here in support of you creating a meaningful life and the person you're becoming. And I'm excited to share a new series with you that will air this summer as America turns 250 years old, which is still pretty young relative to many other countries across this big blue marble that we all share.</p>
<p></p>
<p>The series is called A Perfectly Imperfect Union. In 2022, I rode my bike across America from Astoria, Oregon to the Lincoln Memorial. My wife drove our RV and she had two co-pilots, Jester and Hope, two springer spaniels And when we did it, America was coming out of the pandemic and we were hurting.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Hurting from things that had happened prior to the pandemic, of course, going through what we all went through. And at that time, and this is something I still believe today, is that we were entering an inflection point. An inflection point for us to hopefully pause, breathe, and reflect on who we wish to become as individuals, as communities, and as a country.</p>
<p></p>
<p>As I pedaled across America, I wanted to share America's beauty with others, her natural beauty and the beauty of her people. And I also wanted to share where we were hurting As America turns 250, I believe Kintsugi, which is something we use as a metaphor here at Whole Again, is a perfect metaphor for where we are as a country.</p>
<p></p>
<p>There's so much beauty to celebrate, and we can also acknowledge that parts of us feel broken or are broken, but we can find a way to come back together, just like Kintsugi teaches us. And when we do, we don't try to erase or cover up where we have scars or blemishes. We highlight them in gold, and we celebrate them as symbols of our strength and resilience.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Kintsugi is called the golden repair, and in essence, we can see beauty in something that's perfectly imperfect. During this series, I plan to speak to at least two people in each state and the District of Columbia, so 102 conversations with real folk, as I like to say. We're gonna let the celebrities and the big influencers have their day somewhere else, but here I wanna reach out and talk to real people and listen to their reflections as they think about America turning 250 years old.</p>
<p></p>
<p>And my hope is, is that you'll tune in to at least one, if not all 102, 'cause my theory going into this is that you'll hear different perspectives. Some may be aligned with yours, others may not. But my hope is that you hear the goodness in your fellow citizens and realize, as Maya Angelou shared with us, "We are more alike, my friends, than we are unalike."</p>
<p></p>
<p>We are more alike, my friends, than we are unalike. I've had the privilege of traveling all over the world and all over this country, and this belief is something that I hold deep inside of me. So yes, I do believe that we are more alike, my friends, than we are unalike. So if you're ready to meet one of your fellow neighbors who, like all of us, is perfectly imperfect, take a healthy breath in and a slow releasing breath out and get to know Sarah Gobel</p>
<p></p>
<p>Uh, Sarah, my friend, thank you for joining me on this series, A Perfectly Imperfect Union. How are you feeling today? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Great. Great. It's a beautiful day in Kansas. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Awesome. Yeah. There's, uh, there's no place like home, right? So how many times does, do people from Kansas hear that </p>
<p></p>
<p>Honestly, not as much as you would assume, I guess.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Oh, okay. I figured moving here, 'cause I'm actually from Missouri, so I figured crossing the border I would get a lot more references to Dorothy or Wizard of Oz, but- And </p>
<p></p>
<p>Toto, and- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>I, I, I thought it would come back up maybe w- 'cause Wicked came out, and then- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>Wicked 2 came out, but I, I guess, I guess it's for everyone else- Right</p>
<p></p>
<p>that's </p>
<p></p>
<p>how we think of K- Kansas, so, so- I get a lot more when... My husband is British, so when we travel back to the UK, I guess I get a lot more from people outside of the United States- Ah, </p>
<p></p>
<p>okay ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>than inside. </p>
<p></p>
<p>All right. That's interesting. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>So for those that don't know you, can you take a moment to introduce yourself?</p>
<p></p>
<p>And we already know you're coming from Kansas, so I'll- Yeah ... I'll ask the second part of the question. What's something really cool about Kansas that people may not know about? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Well, um, I have to say Kansas, and I think we agree on this, has the most beautiful sunsets of any place I've been in any of my travels.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Um, b- and I think it's because of the flat, there's so much flat ground that you can just see for miles and miles, but every day we get a different sunset, and they're gorgeous. </p>
<p></p>
<p>I would, as we've talked about- Yeah ... totally agree. Like, no other place I've traveled to, and I've been around the block a few times.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Kansas has absolutely the best sunsets ever. Mm. Yeah. They're so gorgeous. They take your breath away. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Truly. </p>
<p></p>
<p>So l- let's take a moment and we'll go back. Can you introduce yourself and let people know who you are and, like, yeah, who the heck are you and, and why are you here? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah, absolutely. Um, I always say that I'm just another Millennial Sarah, because truly I feel like it's hard to be in a room where there's not another Sarah my age, and I just think that it was a very popular name in the, like, mid to late '80s.</p>
<p></p>
<p>So my name's Sarah. I live in Kansas, but I'm from Missouri. And, um, I always say I'm from the home of Brad Pitt and cashew chicken. That's, like, our claim to fame. Springfield, Missouri. Um, I came here for, I don't know, a more expansive life, I guess, m- uh, out of small town for my child. I have a daughter.</p>
<p></p>
<p>She's gonna be 11 this year, and when COVID hit, it kinda opened up the world. I work in marketing and advertising, and before, um, COVID, you know, you're kinda chained to your desk. But when COVID hit, it l- well, we could work from anywhere really as long as you have an internet connection. So my daughter and I packed up our home, sold it, and moved to Kansas City, um, just to get a little bit more, a little bit more spice in our life.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Um- And it's been great since then. On a trip abroad, uh, I m- I met my husband, my now husband, Brian. We call him Boxy. Um, and we have a beautiful almost two-year-old son, Finnick. Um, and aside from being a mom, which is a full-time job, I, again, work in marketing, design. I work for a very small independent agency called Love and the Machine.</p>
<p></p>
<p>They are actually fixed in C- Chicago, Illinois. But again, with remote work, the possibilities are endless. So I have been with them now for, oh gosh, almost four years, and it's the best job I've had in advertising. Um, being so small and mighty, it gives us some freedom to like pick and choose who we wanna work with.</p>
<p></p>
<p>You know, a lot of us in this realm, we get into advertising and design 'cause we wanna be able to be really creative. Yeah. Um, but sometimes the realm can be a bit limiting in creative capacities. So we love our clients, and we're really enjoying just kind of building our own brand, expanding. We're still a pretty young company.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Um, but we have like a freelance model, so again, we just work with freelancers from around the world even. And if we have a client that has a specific need, we can kind of pick and choose our teams based on who we know so we can create the perfect team for that project, and it's just really fun. I love what I do.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Um, and aside from that, I have also a third job. Um, I started a nonprofit last year called- Wow, </p>
<p></p>
<p>okay ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>yeah, called the Honest Diagnosis Project. Um, and we don't have to get into it, but there's a very long, dramatic story. Um, in 2024, after my son was born, we ran him to a children's hospital, and instead of diagnosing the viral infection that he had, they said he was abused.</p>
<p></p>
<p>And they took both of my children from us for six months. It took us six months to get them back and prove our innocence. Um, and so being thrust into that world that I, I, the only thing I had ever even had against me is a speeding ticket, so didn't know how to get a lawyer, didn't know anything about court processes or, you know, civil rights laws, and it was an eye-opening experience.</p>
<p></p>
<p>And, um, I took my story onto TikTok and found thousands and thousands of families all over the world who are experiencing the exact same thing. So I started the Honest Diagnosis Project to try to help give back, advocate for these families, get them connected with actual experts who can help them prove their innocence.</p>
<p></p>
<p>That is so great that you're taking, like, what is a horrific moment, 'cause I read your account, and I'll put that link in the show notes when our episode gets released. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Thank you. </p>
<p></p>
<p>But you took something horrific, and now you're trying to use it as fuel to help other people, which I think is- Thank </p>
<p></p>
<p>you ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>uh, amazing, and I'm so sorry that you as a f- you as a mom, but also as a family, your kids, your husband, had to go through something like that.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I Had no clue how prevalent this actually is until I read your article about it. So, um, thanks for, you know, taking a really tough moment and trying to make, uh, create a better tomorrow for other people who might be going through it right now. So it- Yeah ... I think it's fantastic that you're using the energy of the moment in this particular way.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Absolutely. Lemonades out of lemons, right? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Absolutely, yeah. It's a lemon- lemons, uh, into lemonade kinda moment. So speaking of lemonade, when you think of lemonade, you think of picnics. So we'll fast-forward maybe, uh, a few weeks into July, August. You're having a picnic, you're with your friends, your family.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Maybe even Brad Pitt stops by. Who knows? </p>
<p></p>
<p>That would be nice. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah, that would be nice, Brad. And Brad asks you, "Hey, what does America mean to you?" How do you respond? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Mm. You know, I think that's tough right now. I feel like in its inception, America meant opportunity. Um, right? And I think growing up in America, that is maybe the, what we were sold that America is.</p>
<p></p>
<p>It's a melting pot of cultures for a better life, for opportunity, you know? Um, but I don't have such a rosy outlook on what America is right now, and my husband always reminds me, again, British, he's like, "America is very young. 250, like in the grand scheme of the world, you guys are like in your infancy still.</p>
<p></p>
<p>You need to learn a lot of really hard lessons before you can play with the big dogs." So America to me is right now, it's about tough growing pains, learning from the mistakes that, um, have been made, are currently being made, um, and maybe still a little bit of opportunity. It's just opportunity to grow from what we know isn't working.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Hmm, interesting. As you mentioned growing pains, it brought me back to the early, uh, childhood days of my youngest daughter who experienced a lot of growing pains. Yes. And so she would wake up in the middle of the night just in, just in so much pain, and she was looking for comfort. Hmm. And like as you describe, yeah, what America means to you right now, I can, I can appreciate the growing pains because, you know, we-- So many people have said this is the land of opportunity, and for some people it still is, but it's certainly we're going through a tough period of time that it may not necessarily be the land of opportunity equally for everyone- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Exactly</p>
<p></p>
<p>uh, out there. Right? So as you think about, like this country and, uh, part of the country is, again, the, the narrative is it's the land of opportunity. And so, so many people came to this country. We're a country of immigrants, and we all have a family story To this country or, or to this land if, if we have roots that are indigenous- Right</p>
<p></p>
<p>to the land. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>So do you know much about your family's story around America and this land? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah, I, on my maternal, my mother's side, um, I don't know a lot. Her mother died, um, when I was very young. Never got to know her. I didn't really... I think her father also, I was like seven when he passed, so- Ah ... there </p>
<p></p>
<p>wasn't </p>
<p></p>
<p>a lot of time spent with that side of the family.</p>
<p></p>
<p>My mom always, you know, says she's got a percentage of Cherokee in her. And again, as you kind of alluded to, I think by nature of America, a lot of us have some maybe ties to Native American roots of this country. Um, and so I don't know a lot about that side. But my father's side, we are all Scandinavians, so we have Viking heritage and, um, you know, Swedish roots and probably the most I know, but I know, like, a lot.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Uh, my ancestors came over here with not a lot of money, and it was quite a struggle, um, to get on their feet and took a while. So there's noth- definitely no, like, lineage of an inheritance tied to my name. We're- ... we're all really fighting for what we need here. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Well, that's a typical American story- Yeah ... of like coming, coming from another country and taking a huge risk, you know?</p>
<p></p>
<p>Mm-hmm. It's so, such a vulnerable and courageous move to think back, you know, to past generations- Yeah ... where they were in one particular country and they're like, "Okay, we're gonna, we're gonna roll the dice or we're gonna make this work," and you had to put in the effort if you didn't have a whole bunch of wealth to support yourself.</p>
<p></p>
<p>So- Right ... a lot of grit, a lot of resilience, a lot of perseverance, the ability to endure. I love the Nordic roots. You know, you probably don't have, unfortunately- Part of your lineage back to Sweden, I imagine you don't get an IKEA gift card promo code. But, but you should. I think- I should ... like all Swedes that live here might get a 10% break on any purchase at IKEA.</p>
<p></p>
<p>So, uh, that could be a new rule. Who knows? </p>
<p></p>
<p>I agree. I like that. Um, I also don't really love Swedish meatballs, which I feel like is- ... blasphemy. Um, but I do drive a Volvo, so there you go. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Okay. Well, see, uh, perfect. It's, it's all lining up, Sarah. It is. It's all lining up. It's all making sense. So your model at work is very pandemic-esque.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Oh, </p>
<p></p>
<p>for sure. Right? You know, uh, b- virtual freelancer, so this gets into new technology- Mm-hmm ... which is part of our conversation- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>uh, really globally, but certainly here in the US around AI. You know- Yeah ... some people feel like it will liberate us, and we'll have all this leisure time, and then other people will be like, "It's gonna destroy us and take all of our jobs."</p>
<p></p>
<p>And then there's always that gray space in between the black and the white. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Where do you stand on AI right now? Just curious. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah, absolutely. I live pretty firmly by the rule, within reason, that I think everything is okay and fine in moderation. And so in, in its inception, AI is a tool that is very helpful to a lot of industries, um, if it was being used in moderation.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I don't know. Again, it's so hard to know nationally what, what the news looks like everywhere. Um, but in Kansas especially right now, we're having protests pretty much weekly because they're trying to stick data centers everywhere. Ah, yeah. And people are not having it because of the clear tie to how it's harming the environment, how it's harming the people around them, and unfortunately what we're seeing is Politicians, um, who are profiting off of these relationships or the people at the top who are profiting at these relationships don't care.</p>
<p></p>
<p>They don't care what the people around them or how they're being affected care or feel about the, these things, and I think that's an issue. Any time we're putting profit over people, um, I have an issue with that. Also, in my line of work, we've already seen it. We're seeing it a lot, actually. One of our largest CPG clients has said several times, "Well, we can just use AI to do what you guys are doing."</p>
<p></p>
<p>Oh, </p>
<p></p>
<p>god. That's an issue, right? Like, we're losing, actively losing business because of things like that, because people have seen that they can just use technology and not have to pay a human. But the reality is AI needs a human touch. It needs a human prompt. It needs somebody who knows the business and know...</p>
<p></p>
<p>Like, in advertising, AI needs somebody who knows consumers and has relationships and can read human behavior to put those prompts in. So you're not gonna get a great output if you don't have a human touch to AI. Um, but do I use AI? Yeah, within moderation, because it does, it makes my life a lot easier. Do I use it to change my hair color or I, my haircut to see what I might look like with a short bob?</p>
<p></p>
<p>No. I don't use it for that. But I, I make sure, I, like, have a once a day rule for myself. I'm gonna use it once a day, but it's gonna be for something that really does add value to my day. Um, so that's kinda in a nutshell. I could probably talk about AI all day, but within moderation it could be amazing, right?</p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah, I appreciate your perspective, and especially, like, as you mentioned, through your work in advertising, so... The g- the great ads, the great advertising brings up certain feelings- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>and emotions. Exactly. And our emotions drive us, right? The most memorable ads bring that up in us, and- I think that requires a human to be able to- I agree</p>
<p></p>
<p>actually spark that. And what I appreciate so much about this series is that I've been able to talk to people outside my little bubble here in suburban New Jersey. I was just speaking with Kimberly from rural Wyoming, and she was talking about data centers too. So as I talk to other people, as, you know, with this country being as big as it is, hearing about how these data centers are popping up- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah</p>
<p></p>
<p>in rural America. And again, this is not something that with my friend group, we're really talking about here right outside of New York City 'cause there's no space to put these centers. But out in rural America, there's plenty of space, and there's not a lot of people in these rural towns to really fight back.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>A- and so I, so I'm, I'm so grateful that you brought it up, and I'm, I'm hearing this message over and over again. And I... it becomes a problem not only for jobs, but also AI as it relates to our climate and energy and all that jazz. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Oh, yeah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>So you mentioned upfront, like, "Hey, we're going through some growing pains.</p>
<p></p>
<p>We're hurting a little bit." So if you could work on fixing something or repairing or healing, you can pick your favorite verb, and maybe it's not perfect, but it's a meaningful first step. And as you know, I use Kintsugi as a metaphor for where we are as a nation. So if you were able to heal and bring us together, if you picked one thing, what would it be to get us on that pathway to greater connection?</p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. I love that. Um, and I feel like my answer's actually probably more radical than most. It's probably my Viking roots, right? Um- </p>
<p></p>
<p>All right. That's, that's cool. Like bring it on. Bring it on. I wanna hear it ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>But I genuinely think we're to a point where the, our government structure is not working for anyone, and I would probably just burn it down and start from scratch.</p>
<p></p>
<p>All right. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Okay Like, I have the match, I'll help. Um- Okay. I think, again, back to this concept of profit over people, how many times can we be shown by lawmakers that constituents are not at the heart of the decisions that they're making, um, with a bunch of decisions, not just data centers and AI, but trading, insider trading, and the fact that Congress couldn't even live off of one of, like my salary, um, as we just saw.</p>
<p></p>
<p>They threw a big fit about that. Um, it's, it's taking the profit, taking the privatization out of these things, um, so that we're all more on like an equal playing field. Uh, I would do that. I would just probably start from scratch. I don't think this two-party system's working for anybody except for those at the top.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Those at the top. So get out the gasoline- Yeah ... get out the matches, and burn, burn the, b- burn the whole motherfucker system down and just- Yeah ... start all over again. And I, I hear you. I think you're not alone in that thinking. Certainly, the point you make is like there's al- so much money- Yeah ... in politics, and money has a way of corrupting people or creating, you know, creating a perspective and voting and legislating and leading in a certain way.</p>
<p></p>
<p>So I'm, I, I, I hear what you, I, I hear what you're sharing. So, uh, um, I, not, maybe not so radical w- in some circles, so we- Right ... we'll see. </p>
<p></p>
<p>It's becoming more- So- ... and more popular of an idea. </p>
<p></p>
<p>But yeah, I, I, I think a lot of people do struggle with just like two parties. You know, when you look at even your husband's former country of England, they have multiple parties.</p>
<p></p>
<p>And I think we, I think we're struggling in certain areas with like- These two people, we, we only have two people- Right ... from which to choose, and none of them seem that good, and it becomes a binary choice or the lesser of two evils. And I think we're, we really are, as citizens, thirsty for leaders that we can be proud of, that will lead with, you know, really caring about who we are and doing what's in the best interest, and not necessarily using the position to line their own pockets.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. And so, um, I hear you. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Actually- So, uh- And I'm sorry, this is like a- Yeah ... tangential conversation a little bit, but something interesting I talk about a lot on podcasts too, is this, this issue, this nonprofit issue, the fighting against medical misdiagnosis. It's actually- Sure ... led me to a really interesting place.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Um, and I have been a bleeding heart liberal my entire life, um- There's really n- nothing much to say about that, but that I have been a bleeding heart liberal, and I think I probably would've shut down conver- certain conversations if it was with a person who didn't identify the same as I did or didn't vote for the same candidate that I did.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Um, and I was pretty open about that. And then when this happened to my family, I noticed quickly that the people on the internet after I went viral that were pouring into my comment section, and they wanted to help, and they wanted to offer support, it wasn't liberals by any means. Um, and the politicians who wanted to help were not liberals, and by some weird, like, kismet situation, I'm now having conversations and locking arms with these people I probably would've never given the time of day.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Ah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>And it kind of just helped n- open my eyes even more. Like, I had a little bit of it, but about this idea that with a two-party system, we truly are divided by design because if we were all having these very important conversations about very real-life issues that i- affect us all, we wouldn't be at each other's throats all the time because more often- Yeah</p>
<p></p>
<p>than not, we're on the same si- like, we're on the same page about almost everything, but, like, with a slightly different font because the talking head of whatever media we're watching is telling us one thing. But the reality is, is if we stopped and, like, actually had meaningful conversations with other human beings, um, I feel like we'd be a lot more powerful and just united.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Uh, United States of America, right? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Absolutely. Uh, as perfectly imperfect as we are, but we're, to your point, we're all going through something, and it's not contingent upon what party we happen to vote for. We all go through some similar everyday things, and by having conversation, we can see, we can see our story in someone else's- Yep</p>
<p></p>
<p>story, and that can form a connection and a understanding. And then from there, we can actually do the work that we need to- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Mm-hmm ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>need to do. So when you think about a birthday- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yes ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>often we think about birthday cake. So I have a two-part question for you, Sarah. What kind of cake are you serving for America's 250th?</p>
<p></p>
<p>And as we blow out the candles of this birthday cake, all 250 of them- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>what are you wishing for? </p>
<p></p>
<p>What kind of cake? Um- I don't know. I wish I had something, like, clever to say about this. I just feel like it's probably not gonna be a cake at all. It's going to be- Okay, </p>
<p></p>
<p>cool ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>it's gonna be a pie. That's way more American, um- Yes</p>
<p></p>
<p>on brand for America, so probably, like- </p>
<p></p>
<p>What, what flavor? ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>probably, like, an apple pie. Um- Apple </p>
<p></p>
<p>pie. Okay, cool. L- maybe a little ice cream on </p>
<p></p>
<p>the side? With ice cream. Always has to be ice cream. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yes. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Depending on what part of the country you're in, maybe there's cheddar cheese in it. I don't know. That's not really- Ah</p>
<p></p>
<p>Kansas' thing, but I haven't tried it. I don't like to yuck anybody's yum. So probably apple pie, and the wish would be for a better America for all of us, um, for the change. Yeah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>That's a good wish. So I've been asking the person that I spoke to last in this series to serve up a question to you. So here's a question from Kyle from Georgia.</p>
<p></p>
<p>If America has a spirit animal, what would it be? And he puts a caveat on this. It can't be an eagle. So what's, what is America's spirit animal? </p>
<p></p>
<p>My... I, I gotta go with my gut, because the first thing that came to my brain was a, like, a, a raccoon, but a ra- a trash panda would be... 'Cause they're called trash panda in the South.</p>
<p></p>
<p>So- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Okay ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>it would be trash panda. </p>
<p></p>
<p>I, I like that. I never even knew that. That, that was- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yes ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>that was the nickname for a raccoon, a trash panda. Yes. That's </p>
<p></p>
<p>pretty cool. There's actually a minor league team in Alabama called the Trash Pandas, so. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Oh, wow. I didn't know that. Look at that. Fun fact. Yeah. This is pretty cool.</p>
<p></p>
<p>So that would, I think... I mean, I gotta go with my gut in that. That is literally the first animal that popped in my head. </p>
<p></p>
<p>All right. A raccoon. So what question do you have for the next person I chat with? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Ugh. Yeah. I, because I have a little insider knowledge, I'm driven to ask your next, your next interviewee what they think is working well with the American justice system.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Okay. All right. That's a good question. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Well, Sarah, thank you so much for putting a good ripple into the world and helping us become a more perfectly imperfect union. Thanks for joining me on this series. I totally appreciate you. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Thank you so much for having me. I love these great conversations.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Sarah's story is incredible, and the link to the article we reference in our conversation, I'll put that in the show notes so you can read up on what her and her family went through. And I love the fact that Sarah took, in my vernacular, a last bad day moment and is trying to turn it into something positive to help others.</p>
<p></p>
<p>And her question to our next guest, Maggie, is thought-provoking. What's actually working in our justice system? So how would you respond to that? Let me know. I'm curious about your answer. And we'll listen to Maggie's answer during our next conversation here on A Perfectly Imperfect Union. And as always, thanks for being here.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Thank you for listening and helping us create a more perfectly imperfect union. I hope you'll check out tomorrow's episode of Whole Again. Until then, remember to celebrate your scars as golden symbols of your strength and resilience. And don't forget to have fun storming the castle.</p>
<p></p>
<p>And if you wish to learn more about creating beautiful ripples and how to prevent a bad moment from turning into a bad day, please visit my website, michaelobrienshift.com, and sign up for my newsletter called The Ripple Effect. And join us each Monday, Wednesday, and Friday here at Whole Again, and discover how you can heal, grow, and become more resilient, and celebrate our scars as golden symbols of strength and resilience.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Until then, remember, you can always come back to your breath. You've got this, and we've got you.</p>
Apple Podcasts
Castbox
Castro
Goodpods
Moon FM
Overcast
Pocket Casts
Podbean
Podcast Addict
Podcast Republic
Spotify