A Perfectly Imperfect Union: Reflecting on America 250 with Brian Riordan

<p> Hey there, it's Michael. Welcome to Whole Again, the show that's here in support of you creating a meaningful life and the person you're becoming. And I'm excited to share a new series with you that will air this summer as America turns 250 years old, which is still pretty young relative to many other countries across this big blue marble that we all share.</p>
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<p>The series is called A Perfectly Imperfect Union. In 2022, I rode my bike across America from Astoria, Oregon to the Lincoln Memorial. My wife drove our RV, and she had two co-pilots, Jester and Hope, two springer spaniels And when we did it, America was coming out of the pandemic, and we were hurting.</p>
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<p>Hurting from things that had happened prior to the pandemic, of course, going through what we all went through. And at that time, and this is something I still believe today, is that we were entering an inflection point. An inflection point for us to hopefully pause, breathe, and reflect on who we wish to become as individuals, as communities, and as a country.</p>
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<p>As I pedaled across America, I wanted to share America's beauty with others, her natural beauty and the beauty of her people. And I also wanted to share where we were hurting As America turns 250, I believe Kintsugi, which is something we use as a metaphor here at Whole Again, is a perfect metaphor for where we are as a country.</p>
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<p>There's so much beauty to celebrate, and we can also acknowledge that parts of us feel broken or are broken, but we can find a way to come back together, just like Kintsugi teaches us. And when we do, we don't try to erase or cover up where we have scars or blemishes. We highlight them in gold, and we celebrate them as symbols of our strength and resilience.</p>
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<p>Kintsugi is called the golden repair, and in essence, we can see beauty in something that's perfectly imperfect. During this series, I plan to speak to at least two people in each state and the District of Columbia. So 102 conversations with real folk, as I like to say. We're going to let the celebrities and the big influencers have their day somewhere else.</p>
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<p>But here, I want to reach out and talk to real people and listen to their reflections as they think about America turning 250 years old. And my hope is, is that you'll tune in to at least one, if not all 102. Because my theory going into this is that you'll hear different perspectives. Some may be aligned with yours.</p>
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<p>Others may not. But my hope is that you hear the goodness in your fellow citizens and realize, as Maya Angelou shared with us, we are more alike, my friends, than we are unalike. We are more alike, my friends, than we are unalike. I've had the privilege of traveling all over the world and all over this country.</p>
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<p>And this belief is something that I hold deep inside of me. So yes, I do believe that we are more alike, my friends, than we are unalike. So if you're ready to get to know one of your fellow neighbors who is perfectly imperfect like all of us, take a healthy breath in and a slow releasing breath out and get to know Brian Riordan.</p>
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<p>Brian, my friend, so good to see you. Thanks for joining me here on A Perfectly Imperfect Union series. So how are you feeling today? </p>
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<p>Hi, Michael. Such a great honor to be here. I am feeling fantastic. The sun and sky is blue, sun is shining. The kids had the last day of school, so nothing could be better. </p>
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<p>Oh, right.</p>
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<p>Yeah. The, the, the last day of school here is on Thursday. We finish up pretty late here in New Jersey, so, uh, but same. The day is a beautiful, beautiful start to the day. Good, good temperature, low humidity, so- Yeah ... nothing to complain about. So, um, for people that, um, might not know you, can you take a moment to introduce yourself?</p>
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<p>Who, who the heck are you, and where are you calling, uh, in from? </p>
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<p>Yeah, absolutely. So, hi, everybody. Um, my name's Brian Riordan. I'm a mapping professional who loves riding mountain bikes and unlocking the ways for people to explore the outdoors. It's truly been a calling of mine since, gosh, all the way through high school.</p>
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<p>Um, I live up in Norwich, Vermont, which is known as the Upper Valley, just a stone's throw from Dartmouth College. Um, and I'm married to, for almost 25 years, to an amazing woman named Molly and have four kids scattered across the globe. Uh, one is currently in the air to Cape Town to study sharks for the next 10 days, actually.</p>
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<p>Wow. That is, that is fantastic. And congratulations on 25 years of marriage. That's- Yeah ... not an easy feat. That's really awesome. So were you one of those kids that would just like pull out the maps in grammar school and high school and just get really geeked out about like where to go and where things were and all that jazz?</p>
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<p>Absolutely. And even beyond that would just be the first person to go, "I think we should go climb that and go buy a book and buy a rope and figure out how to set up some, some flashing and-" Love </p>
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<p>it ... </p>
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<p>It was just one of these moments. We had a couple of friends who were just as eager, and we just went out and figured out how to do things.</p>
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<p>Just went out in the AT with a really bad tent and walked for 25 to 50 miles. Didn't matter. </p>
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<p>That's so cool. Oh, I love it. I love it. So for those that haven't been to Vermont, what's something that's really special about Vermont? </p>
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<p>I'm gonna just go with the really easy one, right? That Vermont is green, and I don't think everybody quite understands why, right?</p>
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<p>And the reason is, is Acts 250. And what Act 250 really did for Vermont way back in, God, I think it might even been the '70s, was it restricted development. Um, anything over pretty much an acre plus of de- of, uh, development needed to get more approval from the state. Um, and on top of that, they banned billboards on highways.</p>
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<p>So as soon as you cross the border, everything just feels tranquil. The mountains are so green. There's just this level of serenity. It's these rolling hills, and it's why we have so much forest and farmland, which kinda creates like the next reason why Vermont's so amazing, is we have so much land to create world-class products from the likes of Jasper Hill Cheese to Hill Farmstead craft beer, and there's more little general stores selling maple creamies in Vermont With Vermont dairy than you can imagine.</p>
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<p>And I think the last little plug, 'cause I know you're a big cyclist, Michael, like myself, is we have more miles of unpaved road versus paved road of a ratio of 8,579 miles of unpaved road to 7,182 miles of paved road, which just means that we are a gravel riding mecca. </p>
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<p>Absolutely. I love the fact that that data just, like, rolled off, rolled off your tongue.</p>
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<p>I was like, oh, that is, like, so perfect to, like, your profession and your interests. I, I think that that's just absolutely fantastic. And the, the thing about the billboards, I was driving through Pennsylvania down to Virginia last month, and I ... Pennsylvania has a ton of billboards. A- and for me at le- at least, it's, it's like, uh, site pollution.</p>
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<p>Yeah. </p>
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<p>And I, and I was wondering, like, during the drive, and I have to do a little digging, uh, into this, it's like, does anyone pay attention to those billboards? Is it ... Or is it just taking up space and blocking our view of all the nature that's around us? So, um, I don't know. Time will tell as I do my research.</p>
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<p>But it, it didn't make ... It, it doesn't make the drive as pleasant as it could be if they were, say, not there, as they are not there in Vermont. </p>
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<p>Right. I feel the same way coming into Hartford these days. I'm just like, "What is all of this?" And I'd say every one out of every two is literally some kind of, like, you know, lawyer trying to grab some money off- Yes</p>
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<p>off an accident. </p>
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<p>Yes. Yes. That abs- absolutely. So those were some really cool things about Vermont. Does any ... Do people get anything, um, wrong about Vermont? K- knowing that we all have bias and we might like, "Ah, those people up in Vermont are like this." Does anything come to mind? </p>
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<p>I think people think that in Vermont that we are, like, probably, like, too socialist on some level, like too, too, like, liberal on some, on some- Too, </p>
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<p>uh, too crunchy granola- Too crunchy granola</p>
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<p>you know, just hanging out like a bunch of hippies eating Ben &amp; Jerry's. </p>
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<p>Exactly. Eating Ben &amp; Jerry's, wearing our patchwork, you know, corduroys. And I think th- the, the area that is, actually, the group is just incredibly humble and incredibly connected to the earth, and why you see so many dairy farmers who, you know, they, they work so hard, and they're fighting so many headwinds across their industry every day, and they still wake up- Oh, </p>
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<p>so true</p>
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<p>at 4:00 in the morning and milk the cows. And I always say a, a, a dairy farmer's career is defined between the milkings. It's how much can you actually accomplish from the first milking to the second? 'Cause if you just, if you sit on, if you sit around and don't work your farm during those eight hours in the middle You're not gonna make it </p>
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<p>Absolutely.</p>
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<p>We as a family used to vacation up in Vermont, um, for 13 years up in Hi- Highgate Springs, so the other side of the state. Sure Like right on Lake Champlain, about two miles south of the Canadian border. And each summer we'd, we would tour a dairy farm, and so we'd just improve our education a- and pr- and help the kids understand that the food, the food that comes, it comes from hardworking people, comes from farmers, you know?</p>
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<p>'Cause, because we don't, we don't really think about that. Like, the food just lands up on our plate or we see it in the supermarket, and we don't... I'm not sure if we totally appreciate or have gratitude for the hardworking people- </p>
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<p>Right ... </p>
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<p>uh, all types of farmers that make our food possible. And so I think we should spend a moment in gratitude before, before any meal.</p>
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<p>But, uh, going up to Vermont and vacationing up there and doing those dairy farm, uh, tours were spectacular. And the point you made earlier about riding your bike, that wa- some of the best riding for me happened up in Vermont. Um, so, uh, very, very cool. So let's, uh, say you're all hanging out. </p>
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<p>Yeah. </p>
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<p>All you hippies up there in Vermont.</p>
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<p>You've mapped out a whole, like, secluded picnic, Brian, and all your friends are there. Uh, and they ask you, "Hey, what's America mean to you?" How do you respond to that? </p>
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<p>You know, when I really think about it, and, and this is gonna sound somewhat, you know, cliche for me being in Vermont and having such a, a s- a history with just being outside, but it means open and free public lands.</p>
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<p>Like it defines- Ah ... our country. Yeah. When you look around at what we have and what we've managed to protect over the time from Roosevelt and our Founding Fathers, we have land. And, um, that has created such an ability to adventure. Um, it means caring about your neighbors, right? It means understanding that they're part of your community and part of your fabric, and without your fabric, you really fall apart Yeah.</p>
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<p>It means standing up for the oppressed. Like I, you know, c- living and growing up outside of Connecticut and going to New York City and the Statue of Liberty and Ellis Island over and over again for school and everything else, it just gets ingrained in you what this is about. It means finding wealth, um, on, uh, in, within opportunities when you put the effort in.</p>
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<p>Like, I still think America is the land of opportunity. And, um, you know, from, from where I've come, from being a ski bum in Steamboat Springs at 18 to living in a waterless cabin in Fairbanks, Alaska once upon a time to now, you know, running a, the, the mapping side of a really industry-leading tech organization is quite a story, um, which I, which I hold a lot of dear to my heart.</p>
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<p>And, you know, to link it back to the top one, it means endless beauty. From Yosemite to Denali, Y- uh, Yellowstone to Arcadia, to the canyons of Utah, to the mighty Mississippi, and even the Everglades. Like, they're all so unique. They all have to call to the different part of your heart. When you're in the, you know, the northern Minnesota on the lakes, it's a tot- and hearing the loons call, it's just absolutely stunning to standing on the 14,000-footers in Colorado, and it's all within our home.</p>
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<p>And everybody wants to go travel to Spain these days or to Italy, and I go, "Have you been to Grand Canyon? Have you-" Yes. "... invested in your country? Have you really gone and seen all the corners of what we have to offer and the wonders of our world?" And The answer most of the time is no. And I think really I would encourage everyone to get out there and go explore America because it will blow your mind.</p>
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<p>It absolutely will. I love what you just said. Uh, th- one of the reasons why I'm doing this series and I ask the questions I ask is to sell America to Americans, to say, like, "All these 50 states all have something special within each of them- Yeah ... and we should go visit them." When I rode my bike across the country, to your point about the land and really the awe-inspiring beauty of our nature, there would be-- there were times where I just stopped riding- </p>
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<p>Yeah</p>
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<p>because my jaw was, like, on my handlebars 'cause I was like, "Oh my God, this is so gorgeous." And, and so big. You know, you don't-- Being on the East Coast here, you don't realize how big this country is until you get out West into states like Oregon and Montana and, uh, Idaho and Wyoming and Colorado. You're like, "Oh my God."</p>
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<p>And it's just absolutely gorgeous. And, uh, thanks for the, the tip of the hat to, uh, Lady Liberty. So when you fly into Newark, if you're on the left side of the plane usually, you get to see her as you come into Newark Airport. So, uh, great reference, great message from Lady Liberty about who we can be as a country.</p>
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<p>So, so as you think about Lady Liberty, obviously people came to Ellis Island. You know, we have a country filled with stories of people who have been on this land well before it was a country, and people who have come from other countries to this land. Do you know much about your story, uh, your family's story about America?</p>
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<p>You know, what's interesting, Michael, is I'm, I'm m- married to, um, um, M- Mary Margaret O'Toole is her maiden name. And so you can imagine she's from, her grandfather was fresh off the boat. Um- Yes ... and, um, h- has direct lineage back and we've actually went over to Ireland and like met her like cousins, you know?</p>
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<p>And like, and like their- </p>
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<p>Well, we're probably related something. When an O'Toole and O'Brien were in sort of like neighboring clans, if you will. </p>
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<p>Exactly, and I always laughed at like, you know, my last name, we, we pronounce it, um, Riordan, and there's, um, you know, uh, we, we, we speculate that there was an O in front of it at one point and it was probably O'Riordan at, at one</p>
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<p>But when we look back in time, it falls apart pretty fast really. Like it's really hard to trace back, which just means to me, I'm like, "We've been here a bit," is my, is my take on it on both my mom's side, which was last name of Bones, and on our side, on my dad's side, uh, Riordan. And so like I kept going like, "What, w- what's my story about America and this land?"</p>
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<p>And, and funny enough, like I sometimes find that history c- doesn't have to be long to have meaning. And so by that I'd go- Yeah ... I look, when I think history and I go, "God, who, what, what is the thing I'm proud of?" It's actually my grandfather, right? And so you think about these- Mm ... these moments with our, with our families, and they always say the Greatest Generation, right?</p>
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<p>And he was. Sure. Like he was this, you know, he was a World War II, um, B17, um, pilot, and- Wow ... he flew 51 missions, you know, Purple Heart, met the King of England. </p>
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<p>Very cool. </p>
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<p>And he had a nickname of Rip Riordan. His, and his, his plane was called The Wahoo. </p>
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<p>Love that nickname. That's so cool. </p>
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<p>Right? And it was just like hearing his stories, and I, and never afraid, he had like</p>
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<p>You know, he was an intense gentleman, right? He, and, um, you know, very driven and very just, you know, like you could, you just always had this drive about him and, um, but he collected stamps, um, which I found- Oh ... was this like beautifully calming moment in his soul 'cause I think it took the edge away. I mean, you can only imagine when 51 missions came back.</p>
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<p>Like he came back, you know, with a team, I think it was a team of eight on those planes, only two made it back that, that, that mission. </p>
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<p>Wow. </p>
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<p>And no engine, right? Well, one of the four engines was out or something of this nature. And I go, the trauma, the, you know, the, the mental- Yes ... anguish he must have held in, never spoke about it, but to bring that.</p>
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<p>And so like when I go like it's, it's, it's based on these people, these, these, these pioneers, these, these just, just, just the heart, um, and soul to just do what's right and to persevere and to never give up, and I just saw it through him And just to sit and to, to be with him was just one of those amazing moments, and to know how just brave and, um, driven he was to protect the world against what he saw as this, um, power of evil, um, which it was, right?</p>
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<p>Um, and, um, I think that, that's where I, I'm anchored. I'm like, that-- I need to be like that, at that level of like emul- like, imitate, like, you know, m- emulate his vision and what he was to me as, you know, he's obviously well passed on now, is something that is really powerful for me, that roots me in America, that I want to continue to dr- to live that tradition and be that strong of an American for, um, for my kids.</p>
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<p>What a great story. Thanks for sharing your grandfather's story with us. That was really Are really special. And yeah, to your point, you know us guys, we have a, a way of, uh, putting rocks in our backpack. We don't like to talk about things. </p>
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<p>Yeah. </p>
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<p>And so they-- he saw in his fellow, uh, fellow warriors out there, saw a lot.</p>
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<p>They experienced a lot. </p>
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<p>Yeah. </p>
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<p>And probably back, especially back in that day, they didn't talk about it, so they, they hold it within them. </p>
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<p>Yeah. </p>
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<p>So it's really cool that he had, he had a hobby, stamp collecting, that was, I would say probably meditative for him, even though he probably would be the type of guy back then who wouldn't say, "Oh yeah, I'm a me-medi-- You know, I, I meditate every day."</p>
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<p>But like that, that whole hobby allows you to slow down and basically reset. </p>
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<p>Yeah. </p>
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<p>Uh, bring some regulation to the body. So very, very cool. </p>
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<p>I'm, I'm really- And- I'm really excited that I, I have the stamp collection, um, actually. It's- </p>
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<p>Oh, wow. Oh, that's nice ... </p>
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<p>really, like I've tried to get into it so many times, but life as we know with young children- Yeah</p>
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<p>and it's busy. Um, and so I am looking forward to that moment to, to settle to, to, to calm, right? And actually be able to like feel that touch and connection. </p>
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<p>Yes. Yeah. And that will be very special too, because you get to build upon his- </p>
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<p>Yeah ... </p>
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<p>his collection. So there's like that real c-connection piece to it.</p>
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<p>So it's also an old school hobby, but current day we-we're talking a lot about new, uh, new tech. AI is definitely in the conversation. I can't escape a day without some type of reference, whether I see it in the media, read about it, talk to someone. So where do you stand on AI? There seems to be a couple different camps to make it really simple.</p>
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<p>Yeah. Like either it's gonna free us up for, you know, a whole bunch of leisure or it will destroy humanity. And then there's also the gray space. It's usually in the shades of gray, but where do you stand on AI? </p>
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<p>Oh, Michael, it's been a journey, like right. Um, I, I must admit, once I fully recognized what it was going to be and do, at least into the tech industry in the short term, I quickly looked at the calendar, looked at my age, looked at the calendar again and said, "Shoot, I can't ignore this."</p>
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<p>Right? If I was two or three years from retirement, I think I would've been like, "Yep, I'm just gonna just bide this wait." </p>
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<p>Whatever. Yep. </p>
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<p>It's gonna impact something, not me, but I'm a for- not, not near, not as near to that number as I think I would like to be. So- I, uh, I embraced it. I decided to double down and really just understand exactly what it is and what we're trying to accomplish with it, at least in the tech industry.</p>
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<p>I've actually even taught some courses here in my little town of Norwich, Vermont, uh, to, um, to more or less, you know, the folks who are just like, "Why is this impacting my Gmail? Like, why is my phone talking about AI? I don't even want this." And I'm-- It's one of those moments of you're not gonna have a choice, so let's understand what it is and not what it isn't so that you can try to grow with it.</p>
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<p>Um, but it's a tool. So this is where I come. This is where I am now. I'm like, this is a tool. This is like a calculator in the past. For me, being someone who has struggled quite a bit with dyslexia in the past, and writing has never been my strong suit, I go, "Wow, I now can write like Hemingway." I have-- My ability to articulate ideas has never been more powerful, and for me, that is a massive accelerator.</p>
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<p>So I look at it as like the calculator for people back in the day who couldn't figure out math. This is my new language calculator for being able to bring my thoughts and ideas into the written word in a way that I've never been able to in my 50 year, years on this earth. And so I do think though that we are in this moment of like, I don't think we're gonna see like what like, what they call entity level AI, at least in my lifetime.</p>
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<p>Um, will it ever get there? We, we shall see. Um, but from where I, I go right now, like it's o- it, it's okay. Embrace it. Let's follow it through. I'm hopeful that with all things, energy costs will come down as technology increases, and it won't be this Armageddon that we think it will be. Uh, you'll see in some, you know, as we continue our conversation here, that I don't believe necessarily in like extremes, right?</p>
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<p>I believe there's, there's an extreme in the left and a right, and usually the answer falls somewhere in the middle with most things like this. Um, I think where I do get sad is when, when, you know, like somebody writes a paper, somebody then gets the paper, they synthesize it with AI. They get five other pe-pe-people's inputs, and they synthesize those with AI, and they create a new paper from those six AI in-inputs using AI, and then you end up with this like AI output that has no real- Yeah</p>
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<p>originality anymore 'cause AI synthesized it and they rewrote it in their own brain. And so I think that's gonna lose a little bit of our ability to really think critically and build stories and narratives at some point here. Um, I think our engineering w- industry's going to be really disrupted for a bit because we're not-- we don't need as many entry-level engineers anymore, and so we're finding that our staff level and our principal level engineers are like, are, are, are the folks who have been in the industry for 10, 20 years.</p>
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<p>It's 10X-ing all of them, right? Because they know architecturally what they're trying to accomplish, and so therefore, they can imagine it now they just have somebody working faster for them. It's the someone who comes in who doesn't know what the engine of the car is supposed to be, but they have a system that they can tell to build a car.</p>
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<p>And they build it, and that just builds a car, and they think it's okay, but really it didn't have wheels. It had square wheels, not round wheels. And they have to go back and they redo it, and they redo it, and that's where the cost starts building up at this point is 'cause they have to keep telling the AI to fix itself, fix itself, but they can't tell it that it needed a round wheel 'cause it didn't know it needed a round wheel.</p>
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<p>It's a healthy way of looking at AI that it's like a calculator for those people that struggled with math. 'Cause you hear, you hear it in the public domain a lot like, "Oh, I'm just not good at math." It becomes like this This joke, if you will, and everyone gives that person a pass. </p>
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<p>Yeah. </p>
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<p>But no one in public really says, "I'm not really good at writing or English."</p>
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<p>Sure. </p>
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<p>Um, you know, there's like a double standard. And so what I've seen is a lot of people will criticize people that use AI to help them write. </p>
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<p>Yep. </p>
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<p>Uh, because they're like, "Well, you're not being pure. This is not your stuff." And but at the same time, that person may be using a calculator for math, right?</p>
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<p>So it's, it's a tool, it's an aid, it's complex. Uh, but yeah, I love your take on it. </p>
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<p>Yeah. </p>
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<p>As, as you know, I use Kintsugi, the Japanese art form of Kintsugi, as a metaphor for my Whole Again podcast, but also this series. So the whole process of pottery breaking and then finding a way for it to be repaired, to heal, to grow.</p>
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<p>We highlight the scars from the pottery as our symbols of strength and resilience. So as you look at the country, there are a lot of different things that we could focus in on. W- what's one thing you would like to focus in on that could help us heal and grow in the spirit of Kintsugi? Maybe it's not perfect, but it's a good first meaningful step.</p>
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<p>Yeah. I think for me, the most important thing for our country to remember is that we We have to have a belief in a two-party system. Like, we've come so far into hating the other side that I th- that I think we've come to the moment that we actually believe a one-party system is actually the right solution, right?</p>
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<p>Like never vote Democrat, never vote Republican, you know, Dumbcrats, whatever, maggots on the other side. Like, all of these things have created this dichotomy that, like, we have to have one, it's not the other. And the reality is it's the balance of two that creates such, like, such the, the, the, such a great America.</p>
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<p>And if all you need to do is look back in history and understand what a one-party system really means, and that terrifies me. But unfortunately- </p>
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<p>Yeah ... </p>
<p></p>
<p>the extremes on the right side, the extremes on the left side have created these squeaky wheels get the voice, and it becomes what people think is are the realities of the masses, and it's not, right?</p>
<p></p>
<p>They're just the loud sides. And the more we bring our, our, our edges closer to the middle, the more we're gonna unify, but always have our divisions. Nobody's saying we all have to wear one tattoo or the other. We're just all saying we have to be able to communicate. We all have to understand. We don't have to agree, but we have to be able to recognize that, like, we were built on a two-party system, and we have to embrace it and continue to foster a two-party system, and that our branches are there for reasons, right?</p>
<p></p>
<p>We can't undermine our c- our, like, the branches of our government. We can't undermine our processes, because once we undermine those, we start to unravel what created us 250 years ago. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. And in 250 years ago, we, and I think we tend to forget this, the Founding Fathers lived it. Democracy is messy. It's complicated.</p>
<p></p>
<p>There, there's collaboration, there's compromise. It's, it's not easy. It's not my way or the highway. It's, it's messy and it's slow, and maybe slow for reason, to be really thoughtful and intentional. And you can... There was a point in time where you could completely disagree with someone, and then at night you'd go out and get a drink with that person, you know, on a policy, and we seem to have lost that, and my hope is that we, we get it back.</p>
<p></p>
<p>So it might not be a drink that we go out for this summer, but it could be a slice of cake because the birthday comes up. And for most people, and this is something I've learned in this series, I've gone in completely biased that everyone has birthday cake on a birthday. But a lot of people have played back like, "Yeah, I'm not much of a cake fan."</p>
<p></p>
<p>So I, I've loosened the question a bit. So what are you serving for America's 250th birthday? Maybe it's cake, maybe it's something else. And as you blow out the candles, what are you wishing for, Brian? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Wow I, I am, I, I, you know what? I'm probably not even gonna go to a dessert. I'm, uh, I'm more of a kind of like a slow roasting kind of barbecue person, so I'm- Oh, </p>
<p></p>
<p>okay.</p>
<p></p>
<p>All right. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Right? </p>
<p></p>
<p>So- I think that's, I think that's very American. </p>
<p></p>
<p>I think that's- I think that's very appropriate ... we're probably gonna slow roast a big brisket and just, you know- Mm ... invite as many people over as humanly possible. We spent a ton of time in, in, um, Fairbanks, Alaska, where all we had to eat was salmon and caribou more or less, and we went to all these potlucks, and it was more or less how many different ways could you cook salmon, was what the meal- Right</p>
<p></p>
<p>choice was every single time. Um, and so I just always still f- love this potluck concept of just everybody bringing a big dish together, m- tons of meat, tons of options, and I hope everyone brings their own cut of brisket because it'll be fantastic. And, um, you don't need to always make sure you have the potato salad and everything.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Just have everybody bring what they love, um, and, uh, what they have in their fridge, 'cause that's what it was when we were starving grad students up north. It was- </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah ... "</p>
<p></p>
<p>Oh, we have a bunch of salmon, so we're making salmon again." </p>
<p></p>
<p>I love it. I love it. And so do you have a, do you have a wish for the country outside the, the, you know, basically what you said earlier about trying to find a way for us to come together and lose the labels that we tend to place on each other?</p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. We-- I think we have been this. I think, I'm not sure if we've lost our way or could we amplify what we are, but I truly-- to be a beacon of inspiration for the world. There, there's always going to be folks that are, that are hate, that, that want to hate or want to destroy or want to bring down because as I tell my, you know, my children who wanna be frustrated with a referee or frustrated with a teacher or frustrated with, with a situation, like it's always the-- it's always easy to nitpick.</p>
<p></p>
<p>It's always easy to point out flaws. It's much more challenging to be the person who comes with the solution, with the positive angle, with the way to s- help create and craft a new idea. And so that's kind of a rule I have with my kids . Like, you can't come to me with a problem from the ref unless you have a solution of what they should've done better or a way you would've done it better.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Sure. And so, like, we have the ability to, to... and drive and intelligence to truly shine on the world stage. And I don't wanna be critical of, like, bombs and military. Like I said, I, I, I love my, my, my grandfather, right? I've been most proud of what he accomplished. But I think we're also in an age of intelligence and an age of, like, we can solve the big problems.</p>
<p></p>
<p>We can solve world hunger. We can bring together medicine and through technology and, and, you know, desalination and really make the world a better place, and I think that is where we have this, this moment where it's like, is it nationalism? Is it globalism, right? Um, and I truly believe I'm a, I'm a big globalism fan because I believe the weakest link in our society is the weakest link in our society, and every time you strengthen that weakest link, you strengthen the society as a whole- Yeah</p>
<p></p>
<p>um, not just p- one person or another. And so I, I, um, probably why I'm very much in Vermont at times, like I do believe in our society, and I do believe in those individuals. So I just want-- I believe we-- my, my actual deepest birthday wish is that we embrace our innovation, and we embrace our courage and actually try to make the world better in the face of adversity, in the face of all these countries and groups and people that do- Mm-hmm</p>
<p></p>
<p>want to cause harm to us or other people. We can still be the better individual, the better country, and continue to stand o- stand up. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. Mm. That's a fine wish. Fine wish. So we'll close up here our great conversation. Again, thanks for being here and doing it. So I spoke last time to Laura, she's from Missouri, and I asked her what question does she have for you, and here is her question.</p>
<p></p>
<p>It ties in a way back to the Serenity Prayer, the, the Serenity Prayer about, like- Having, um, you know, knowledge about what you can control and what you can't control, and the wisdom to know the difference. Is there something right now that you're trying to control but in reality it's, uh, something- Yeah</p>
<p></p>
<p>that's uncontrollable? </p>
<p></p>
<p>It's funny, Michael, you and I might, might have been talking about it, um, well, you know, or, or in one of our other conversations and it's, it's actually my children, right? You can craft them, you can instill ideas, you can bring... You model great behavior, but at the end of the day, they are gonna go be their own being.</p>
<p></p>
<p>All right? And even, you know, my 22-year-old, I'm trying to, like, still control, and I'm realizing more and more that it's not a thing to control. It's, it is that you need to g- let go more or less, um, and trust that you've given them the number of tools that they, that they need to create their own tools and create their own paths and, um, and if you really overthink and stress that out and really let it bring on you, it will cause a lot of challenge and a lot of sleepless nights that otherwise you really know you can't control.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Yeah. Uh, sage advice. Yes. So you have to trust the process as a parent and, you know, you, you like, you, you try to lay down some, uh, some good foundational blocks. You hopefully have faith that they have been listening all along, and they are gonna become their own person. So, uh, you have to, yeah, l- ease the grip on the handlebars, if you will.</p>
<p></p>
<p>So if we, if we always white-knuckling the handlebars, it doesn't make for a very pleasant ride. So all right. So what question do you have for the next person, your next neighbor that I chat with? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Um, my question would be: what is the greatest adventure you have gone on, and why? </p>
<p></p>
<p>Oh, wow. I love it. That's a great question.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I can't wait to ask that f- uh, of the next person I chat with in this series. Brian, thanks for joining me here on A Perfectly Imperfect Union. So I appreciate the ripple effect you're putting into the world, so again, thank you. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Appreciate you, Michael. Thanks for bringing this voice out to America on our 250th birthday.</p>
<p></p>
<p>This is fantastic. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Peace.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I love Brian's take on AI. It's something I haven't heard before. And just in general, I appreciated his energy and his reflections on America at 250. I'd love to hear what resonated with you from what Brian shared. And I do love his question around what's the greatest adventure you've been on? I would say my ride across America, which is a spark for this series, but I will say my marriage to my wife.</p>
<p></p>
<p>It's been a great adventure all tied together by true impeccable love. So how about you? Let me know and put your answer in the comments. And my hope is that you tune in to the rest of the series as we march towards election day here in the US and travel America asking everyday people like you about their reflections as America has now turned 250.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I also hope you'll check out the next episode of Whole Again and share it with someone that could use it. And until then, let's remember to celebrate our scars as our golden symbols of </p>
<p></p>
<p>our strength and resilience. And don't forget to have fun storming the castle.</p>
<p></p>
<p>And if you wish to learn more about creating beautiful ripples and how to prevent a bad moment from turning into a bad day, please visit my website, michaelobrienshift.com, and sign up for my newsletter called The Ripple Effect. And join us each Monday, Wednesday, and Friday here at Whole Again, and discover how you can heal, grow, and become more resilient, and celebrate our scars as golden symbols of strength and resilience.</p>
<p></p>
<p>Until then, remember, you can always come back to your breath. You've got this, and we've got you.</p>